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Feb 4
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Susan Pagac's avatar

For eVeRything, right? Including comments?! 😳

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Nakayama's avatar

I sort of came from the other side of the spectrum. Except for Christianity, gun rights, and abortion, I am as conservative as any conservative in the US. I have voted Republican since I was eligible to vote. But over time, I come to regard the Democrats as real bastards and the Republicans as fake gentlemen (and real hypocrites). I am probably a bit more pro-DJT than you are, but I also agree with what Steve Banon said, that DJT is but a vehicle for the revival of conservatism and true American Values. It is not that DJT is anywhere close to a saint, but rather for this leg of the journey, the best way to move ahead toward the right destination is to ride his coattail rather than against it. There will be a time when DJT fades out and another leader shows up. Yet we know beforehand the next leader will be no saint either. I think people who truly deserve democracy are competent, productive, and reasonable people who will uphold social contracts and need no bailout. However, the human life span is short, and accumulated wisdom and integrity don't easily pass to the next generation. Yet, the next generation should pay their own dues to earn their citizenship and deserve their democracy, not because we grant them any. Therefore, I shall strive for my best. But in case I don't see what I like before I am out, then so be it. The struggle between good and evil will be forever.

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Ohio Barbarian's avatar

Thank you for the thoughtful reply. I'm sure we don't agree on everything, but, like Frederick Douglass, I am willing to work with anyone to do good on something. There's clearly a lot of work that needs to be done.

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jacob silverman's avatar

I am an artist. Convince me that conservatives are as creative as I need people to be. Conservative values are great; liberal values are great. You cannot resolve this. It is the basic historical divide. All capitalistic type countries since the Fr. Revolution have this characteristic of a left vs. a right. Always. Conservative vs. Liberal. Always has been / always will be. This is one divide that is characteristic of a whole stage of mankind.

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Nakayama's avatar

I would concur that in the aspect of creativity, there is probably no contest between the conservatives and the liberals. However, the genius of the conservatives tends to show up in engineering and something physical (like building a dam). The genius of the liberal tends to be more abstract (including math and computer science, but mostly arts, media, and performance.) One certainly cannot label liberals as evil (although I do have that tendency due to personal experiences). Logically you are definitely right: good vs evil is a completely separate matter from conservative vs liberal. Ultra-conservativism without proper reasoning and logic behind it is just as bad as ultra-liberalism. Moderation and reasoning are critical to avoid going to the extreme.

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Kevin Smith's avatar

Great article!

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Kaveh Ahangar's avatar

I used to go to people like Michael Moore for this kind of commentary. Now he's a dinosaur like all the rest of them.

Cheers to the Whigification of these losers.

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Ohio Barbarian's avatar

So did I, in what seems like another age.

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Penelope Prill's avatar

The Michael Moore of Roger and Me was great. Now ..... cringe.

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Prodigal's Journey's avatar

I did not pour enough whiskey...

I said when I subscribed that I disagree with you a lot, but this is worth the money. It's good.

My only hope is that we're going to see a sea change in politics and the parties that becomes centered around power and wealth disparities and the disintegration and despair of the working class. And the degradation of the poor. And I blame both parties for our current situation.

Serious question...who is there in the US that can carry the mantle of Bernie. I don't see anyone. I'm not even sure Bernie is that person anymore, if he ever was.

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Mr. Raven's avatar

Bernie with his muh anti vaxx onsie is just another DNC shill.

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OverFlowError's avatar

That was a pathetic effort by old man Bernie. It seemed like he was jealous there wasn’t an 81sie to fit him. It was comical.

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GhostlessBones's avatar

Think I'm done trusting Sanders. He's either too weak to actually create change or he's controlled opposition.

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Ohio Barbarian's avatar

I think the preponderance of the evidence indicates both.

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Ohio Barbarian's avatar

Thanks. Your second sentence means everything to me.

As for your question, no, Bernie is CLEARLY not that person. I don't see anyone either, so that means we're going to have to do some things ourselves. It sucks, I know, but there it is.

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Mr. Raven's avatar

Seeing shitlibs double down on loving the coup factory USAID is legit making me grind my teeth with rage.

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Ohio Barbarian's avatar

I TOLD you to fortify yourself with THC or alcohol first!

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Mr. Raven's avatar

I have been seeing it everywhere.

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OverFlowError's avatar

And yet how many US citizens have any idea about how USAID has been used as the tip of the spear for regime change abroad? They see the letters AID and think charitable aid, and some of it could be seen as such. But most of it is to drive desired political outcomes abroad. I suspect there’s not a lot I’d agree with many in this forum but that is a point of consensus.

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Mr. Raven's avatar

OB is pretty tolerant. I am pretty far right and he tolerates me being here.

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The Revolution Continues's avatar

It's the year to #DumpTheDuopoly. There is no other option that's rational and will save the planet from utter disaster. None.

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Ohio Barbarian's avatar

Truer words were never spoken.

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The Revolution Continues's avatar

If we don't dump them now, we might not get another chance...

https://therevolutioncontinues.substack.com/p/they-did-it-again-and-again

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WickedLizzie's avatar

"Disabled Veteran" is an identity. My daughter is a disabled veteran, she is former Navy. My grandfather was a WWII Disabled Vet, he served in the Pacific theater aboard the USS Montpelier, the Monty, luckiest ship in the US Navy, hit with lots of duds, nothing live.

People tend to not like identity politics unless they’re the one benefitting from it.

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Ohio Barbarian's avatar

"Disabled Veteran" isn't an identity, it's a description, and an easily identifiable class of people who have earned a helluva lot more than they have ever received.

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WickedLizzie's avatar

Ok, if you say so. I didn’t comment to fight, I commented to share my perspective which you clearly feel free to dismiss. But my daughter calls herself a disabled vet, as did my grandfather.

I call myself a disabled person too because my disability impacts how I’m perceived.

Identity politics has roots in the Disability Rights movement and Civil Rights Movement.

As a veteran yourself, you fought for our rights too. Descriptions can be part of a person's identity, they don't fully define who a person is. You proudly identify as a veteran yourself even though you deny that it’s an identity, it’s just a description.

But if you report an assailant, the cops will want a description so they can then identify your attacker so they can be apprehended. Everyone has an identity, it’s who we are. Why should identity be omitted in politics? How does omitting it benefit society?

Asserting it’s just a description is reductive.

You said "an easily identifiable class of people". That’s identity.

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Ohio Barbarian's avatar

I'm not sure we really disagree. They ARE disabled vets, but they are more than just that. When they are identified as only those things, and it is assumed that they must also think a certain way and vote a certain way, that's identity politics.

Identity politics emerged from the postmodernist movement in academia in the 1970s. It was a well-financed and successful effort to drive Marxism, as in the doctrine from which Soviet Communism grew, out of college campuses and high schools. I was there. I remember it well.

Economic class analysis was strongly discouraged. Tribalism was in. Racialism was in, feminism, and soon all sorts of other isms, leading almost inevitably to an absurd ideology that says we have dozens of different genders and little children can be shown which one they truly are, for a ridiculous fee, of course.

Postmodernism and identity politics gave us woke, and the spectacle of a Democratic President saying transgender people were the bravest people he had ever met after crushing a railroad workers strike while proclaiming he's the most pro-labor president in history. But because Democrats IDENTIFY as pro-labor we're supposed to respect their identity and BELIEVE them.

It's a con. The whole thing.

What the postmodernists mean by identity is not the same as what you mean, I think.

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WickedLizzie's avatar

Disability rights identity politics is a form of identity politics that focuses on the experiences of people with disabilities. Am I only my disability? My former employer used it to discriminate and I lost my job. So they thought I was. I don’t think we are close together on this, you’re talking apples, I’m talking oranges. Your knowledge of 1960-1970s cultural history does not truly inform you of the disability rights movement if you’re connecting it to Marxism and Academia and wokeness. Those are all emotional buzz words and not where I was going.

I’ve been following you since October 7, 2023. Based on what I have read in your blog posts, I'm guessing that you are a man in his mid 60s who is a veteran and is disenfranchised with the Democratic Party. You assert yourself as independent and try to pretend you are neutral, but you lean right. You outright dismissed my perspective, which is fine, you owe me nothing. But then in further discussion, you reveal your bias by using straw-man arguments, red herrings and misdirection with irrelevant information I can only guess is intended to obfuscate your true agenda.

Before you accuse me of being an academic, I am just a high school graduate, I didn't have college as an option and I'm not going to disclose more than that. Your bias is evident and your disgust of Democrats is not subtle. So pretending that you're an independent while parroting right wing talking points that have nothing to do with disability rights is revealing.

Thank you for your time.

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Alan Hodge's avatar

“Isolate, Alienate, Indoctrinate:” the classic cult program, and hoo boy, have they got it down pat. I lost fewer friends when renouncing religion than I did denouncing c19.

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Ohio Barbarian's avatar

I live in Ohio, and Covid skepticism grew rapidly here, especially since Cleveland was one of the first cities hit and just not all that many people went to hospital BEFORE the lockdowns.

Here it was refusing to vote for Hillary or Kamala. Democratic family members cut us off, not the other way around, and ours is a very common story. Even voting third party or not voting at all was an Evil Thing that made us outcast unclean to the good Democults.

It's very sad and unnecessary.

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brian gilmore's avatar

The moment they threw the Rev. Jesse Jackson to the dogs in 1988, I knew this moment was coming. I don't agree the party is done though. These parties are not parties. The Democrats and the Republicans are more like political cartels that control the political apparatus in America. The two are in collusion over that control. They are less worried about winning and losing than they are about the political machinery: the television networks, the digital news outlets, the local election machinery, the organizations that get their voters out for them. That is why they pivoted right to begging for money rather than protecting the state. The more progressive members like Raskin got to work on confronting the illegal acts of Elon Musk. That is why Raskin, AOC, Crockett, and many others get no leadership posts. Pelosi and Jeffries and Schumer are determined to keep the cash party going. They stop caring about issues and people long ago.

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The Passionate Progressive's avatar

I don't compare them to 'cartels' - diseases are more appropriate....as in cancers or viruses...Think about it....Weren't Obama's victories supposedly the end of the Republican Party??!! Or was it the response to W......On the other hand perhaps vampires or zombies is a more appropriate title...

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Mr. Raven's avatar

So you are in favor of USAID coups? Fuck off shitlib?

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Ohio Barbarian's avatar

If they are cartels, they are cartels that have to win elections every once in awhile to stay in business. You are exactly right that both parties are both gigantic moneylaundering organizations, they both need to keep the grift flowing through their bank accounts, and neither are too particular about the source.

But I don't think the Democrats are going to be capable of winning enough elections to keep that grift flowing, and if I'm right, the Democratic Party might shrink to something irrelevant like the Greens if it doesn't disappear entirely.

The oligarchy will move quickly to launch a new-and-improved political party if this starts to happen. They've already made a couple of tentative experiments, but this time they'll come up with something claiming to be "centrist," which will be controlled by many of the same oligarchs who control the Democrats now. Maybe some narcissistic megabillionaire will lead it.

The will want to keep the duopoly going if they can.

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Roben Jones's avatar

Another raised to be a lifelong Democrat here.

Bill clinton disgusted me,but I didn’t leave the Democrats until 2016. the stolen primary finished me forever.Itcwas plain that they were never going to do the decent thing again.

Their actions now should show it clearly enough.What are they doing to stop Trump and Muskrat’s power grab?Not one damn thing except strongly worded letters.All theater.Every one of Trump’s lousy nominees has been rubber stamped so far.

It’s nothing to them,they can fund raise like crazy off it all.The worse he does, the better they like it.

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Ohio Barbarian's avatar

You've seen the pattern, haven't you? The Democrats LOVE being out of power. That way, they can say they can't do anything because they're out of power, while scaring the shit out of the libs to donate to their grifting operation so they can get back in power to "clean up the Republican mess."

Then they win, make the mess worse, lose, rinse, cycle, repeat.

I just think their washing machine is broken because it's so far out of balance with most Americans. Their approval rating's less than a third of voters now, and it will only get worse with the kinds of displays we saw at the DNC.

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Roben Jones's avatar

Oh yeah,they’d rather lose with a conservative like the Camel than win with asocial Democrat.

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Haikugal's avatar

https://youtu.be/5RpPTRcz1no?si=oiIEMtc3eNWnqpAz I wish we still had Jackpine Radicals to gather but here we are so I bring you this tidbit of relevant information. Thanks OB and greetings all!

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Roben Jones's avatar

I miss JPR

too.I was there toward its end,growling like the grizzly I am.

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jacob silverman's avatar

No, I am not that one person because I already gave up on the Dems just like you. But you did convince me you are worth a read occasionally. Good piece, Barbara.

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Penelope Prill's avatar

I was a Democrat for decades. I voted for McGovern, their last decent candidate. Hell, I was born when Truman was president. I remember Ike. For awhile, I claimed that both parties were bad but at least the Democrats would throw some change at widows, orphans and the disabled. Obama finally tore it for me. He was the banker's bum boy period. Palming himself off as principled, he looted the poor and killed as many people as he could here and abroad. And the FBI, JESUS WEPT. That gang was founded by a cross dresser who, a long with his buddy Cardinal Spellman, abused rent boys. Hoover specialized in spying, secret record hoarding and blackmail. A delicious irony occurred when Hoover denied the existence of the Mob because the Mob owned a photo of Hoover performing fellatio on Clyde Tolson. The American government is TOTALLY CORRUPT. Revolution is the only answer.

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Roben Jones's avatar

The2016 election made me walk away.

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OverFlowError's avatar

OB, you heard of Reagan Democrats. You’re Trump Democrat. Get used to it. The dems are finished in their current configuration of woke identity politics and outright socialism/communist economic policies. They combine those negatives with an aggressive desire to formalize speech censorship throughout society. They would willingly adopt Chinese style social credit scoring to limit travel, credit and job opportunities. They are poisonous to the American Character writ large and hostile to our history which they believe must be rewritten. They will either change or continue the way of the Whig Party.

One thing you’re mistaken about but there’s so much propagandizing about (so I don’t fault you much on it… depending) is Gaza and the current iteration of the Israeli/Palestinian conflict. There’s no ongoing genocide in Gaza. Neither the numbers nor the military intent are there. They just aren’t. It’s a dirty business to be sure but all such urban conflicts are cut from the same cloth. Gaza is 141 square miles with 2.1 million Gazans. Berlin is 344 square miles and 3.66M residents or thereabouts. Think about the destruction wrought on Berlin at the end of WW2. If you’re a people residing in such confines, it’s best to develop peace loving qualities. Waging war from that strategic limitation is suicidal. And they are suicidal because their motivating characteristic is Jew hate. If you could coin wealth on that as a national characteristic, they’d all be as rich as Croesus. And the problem solved.

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